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Erik Brooks

I am sick and tired of hearing about 8.5.1

Erik Brooks |   | Tags:  8.5 lotus domino 8.5.1 notes | Comments (5)  |  Visits (1,179)
I'm sure some people are jumping right in here with a raised eyebrow so let me say this up front:  I'm not tired of hearing about new features coming in 8.5.1.
 
What I'm tired of is finding and hearing about all of the things that are still broken in 8.5 FP1 that won't be fixed until 8.5.1 ships. Some of which have apparently been "fixed" since March but still didn't make it into 8.5 FP1.
 
DDE is pig-dog slow, glitchy, and buggy. And riddled with stuff that still hasn't been fixed since the 2nd Beta for 8.5.0.
 
According to some forum posts many of these things are "fixed in 8.5.1" or "much improved in 8.5.1".  Good thing we read the forum. Once again I ask: what has happened to the Fix List database? It's a ghost town.
 
8.5 shipped with enough regression bugs to sink a ship. Heck, it had a Critical Fix released the same day as it shipped. I've been working with Lotus Support on some 8.5.0 and 8.5 FP1 crashes for 2+ months revolving around the NotesViewNavigator class, which was proven buggy as far back as January. That class has been around since R5, but apparently was changed in 8.5 (for XPages, if I had to guess). Logic would dictate that IBM would have unit tested that backwards and forwards, but it obviously wasn't. This is Software Quality 101 stuff here, guys.
 
8.5.1 is supposedly on track for an October release. TEN months for a dot-one update? I think that's a new Lotus record.  Heck, 8.5's first Fix Pack was a 7-month wait. Keep in mind that there is no 8.0.3 upcoming, and there will only be minor Fix Packs to 7.0.x from here on out.
 
Perhaps 8.5.1 is so far behind the usual schedule because it's got so many wonderful new things in it. That's nice, but it's got me worried. If there are more regressions is it going to be another 7 months before 8.5.1's first Fix Pack? If this is the new Lotus release schedule, the quality better be way up there. 8.5.0 simply doesn't cut it.
 
Keep in mind that I wouldn't be so irate if it wasn't for all the good stuff that's so close, yet out-of-reach: XPages, DAOS, etc...Hopefully 8.5.1 will be the "real" 8.5.0.
 
</rant>
 
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Comments (5)

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1 Simon O'Doherty commented   Permalink No RatingsRatings 0

Ooh a link to a thread with me in it. :)

 
 
Fixpacks are a bit more stricter on what can go into them. For example even if a hotfix was created for an issue it may not get into a fixpack if hasn't met the same level of testing. Other factors can impact its inclusion (eg. age of fix, number of customers reported/impacted/fixed).
 
 
The NotesViewNavigator issues I worked a few PMRs on this and I know were submitted for FP release. However they didn't make it in time for the cut off. So they would be rolled into the next release.
 
 
As for 8.5.1. I am using it at the moment and it is very snappy. DDE is very fast and nice new features. I think you will be happy when you get to play with it.
 
 
But then I liked 8.5 and I know not every ones requirements/environment are the same. :/
 
 
The only thing I can suggest is if you have an issue, report it. The more people impacted by an issue can help development in addressing the issues.
 

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2 Ed Brill commented   Permalink No RatingsRatings 0

Erik,

 
 
I think you have some extremely valid points. Having said that:
 
1) We decided to ensure that 8.5.1 is of very high quality. A separate development team was set up to specifically focus on SPRs and they have addressed a much higher number for 8.5.1 than for any previous maintenance release. Some of those made the FixPack but as Simon says, the threshold is much higher for a fixpack.
 
2) Again many of the specific issues you speak of are already addressed in 8.5.1. The comments in the managed beta forum are of the type that CD8 (current beta drop) is performing extremely well, including DDE and the Mac build. I feel like we needed the extra time to ensure that we got all these issues addressed.
 
3) The 8.0.x codestream was moved to fixpacks only to signal that we believe that 8.5.1 is the target for all Notes customers once it becomes available.
 
 
Are you in the managed beta? You should get in if you are not. See this post on my blog: http://www.edbrill.com/ebrill/edbrill.nsf/dx/update-on-notesdomino-8.x-maintenance-release-plans which also explains a lot of what you are ranting about.
 
 
I ***promise*** that regressions are a specific focus and the reason why we haven't shipped yet. We are going through as many as possible and getting them addressed, and that the regression testing for 8.5.1 is rigorous.

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3 Ed Brill commented   Permalink No RatingsRatings 0

Oh and on the fixlist database -- point taken. We know we need to get a resource on that at/by eGA.

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4 Nathan T Freeman commented   Permalink No RatingsRatings 0

Grandstand much? ;-)

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5 Charles Robinson commented   Permalink No RatingsRatings 0

I am participating in the managed beta and can say that there are a *LOT* of changes in 8.5.1. We don't have a separate fix list database, either. Imagine being in a position where you're supposed to test and you have no freaking clue what's being changed underneath you. I'm having a really hard time telling what's a bug, what was changed for XPages/Eclipse/SPR, and what is simply new.

 
 
From a high level I like 8.5.1 a lot. I feel it's what Lotus promised 8.0 was supposed to be, and it is a good jumping off point for moving forward.

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